THE Gentleman's Magazine; For AUGUST, DEBATES in the HOUSE of COMMONS, Continued from p. 296. Monday, Feb. 14. HE Houfe of Commons hav ing, on Friday the 11th, refol ved, nem. con. (fee page 296), That a letter in a newspaper intitled thePublic Advertiser, Friday, Feb. 11, 1774, and purporting to be printed for H. S. Woodfall, Sec. addreffed to Sir Fletcher Norton, and reflecting on his character as Speaker, in relation to an application to this Houfe, by petition, for an inclofure of lands in the parish of Toffing ton, is a falfe, malicious, and fcan. dalous libet, highly reflecting on the Speaker, to the dishonour of the Houfe, and in violation of the privileges thereof;" and ordered, that the faid H. S. Woodfall do attend this House: the order of the day was read, and Mr. Woodfall called to the bar, and examined; who, having acknowledged the publication, named the Rev. John Horne as the author, and fubmitted himself to the mercy of the House (the iffae of which bufine fs we have already related, p. 13-), it was "Ordered, That the faid John Horne do attend the House uponthe Wednesday following." The evafion of this order, the taking Mr. Horne into cuftody by virtue of the Speaker's warrant, his fubmif. fion, and examination at the bar of the Houle, with the debate that followed (being one of the warmest that hap pened during the feffions), we fhall here bring together, though fome days elapfed, and other material bufinefs intervened, between the firft order for his attendance, and his appearing at the bar of the Houfe; for, on 1774. Wednesday, Feb. 16. The order of the day being read, and the Rev. John Horne not appearing, the meffenger employed to ferve the fummons was called in, and informed the Houfe, that, on Monday, in the evening, he delivered the letter he had in truft to a gentleman at Mr. Tooke's, in Serjeants Inn, Fleet-ftreet, who faid his name was John Horne, and who faid, when he had read the letter, that he believed there must be fome mistake, as there are several John Hornes in the city befides me." He added, "but give my compliments to Mr. Hatfell [the fubfcribing clerk], and tell him, that, when an order of the House of Commons is directed to me, I fhall' think it my duty to pay obedience." Befides this verbal declaration of the meffenger, a letter was produced, and read, of which the fallowing is a copy: "Ta J. Hatfell, Efq; Clerk of the Houfe of Commons. "SIR, "LATE laft night I received a notice, figned with your name, of an order which the House of Commons made yesterday for the attendance of a particular perfon on Wednesday next, "I apprehend that notice must have been intended for fome other perfon, and delivered to me by mistake, of which I informed the bearer the very moment after I had read it; at the fame time adding, that, whenever the Houfe of Commons thall defire my attendance, I will pay to them all pro per and prudent refpect. י. I have the honour to be, &c. After reading this letter, Mr. Her bert, member for Wilton (not Sir Harbord Harbord, as was mentioned by mistake), moved, "That the Rev. Mr. Horne be taken into cuftody of the Serjeant at Arms." But the Spea ker 342 Proceedings in Parliament, 1774 going on. Suppofe that Woodfall's journeymen prove nothing fatisfactory, will you adjourn again and look for freth evidence? I dare predict, that W's men will throw no greater lights upon the matter than their maler. Why trouble us then with their attendance? why alarm the nation with an enquiry which most probably, in the end, will expote us to general ridicule ? - In every court of juftice a man undergoes but one trial for one offence; Mr. Horne has undergone his trial for the libel imputed to bim, and I am of course again the prefent queftion, becaule nothing now remains for us, but to decide upon the evidence which has been produced. If the adjournment tes place, Woodfall's men may be tampered with; and 10 ferve their mafter, whofe pardon is perhaps to be pucchafed by Mr. Horne's conviction, they may poffibly do whatever they are commanded by the managers of this profecution. Mr. S.lc-t-r G-n-ral.] From the candid behaviour of Mr. Woodfall when he was before the House, as well as from the moderation with which he was treated, I dare fay the Honourable gentleman who spoke laft does not, with respect to the libel which has created the prefent debate, imagine that Mr. Woodfall is in a very perilous 6tuation.-Nay, from the conduct of the Houfe to Mr. Horne, and the repeated admonitions he received with respect to his defence, I am fure no man can put his hand honestly upon his heart, and fay that the Imallest prejudice has appeared against him from an individual of this affembly.--I appeal to his warnet fupporters.--I appeal to the galleries, to every auditor who hears me, whether thofe whom the honourable gentleman would infinuate to be among the foremost of his enemies, have not acted as if really anxious for his acquittal..-They have given the best advice for his defence.... They have been the firft to point out the infufficiency of the prefent evidence against him.---They can have no inteBest to advance even by his conviction. They may find muchtrouble, but theycan gain no emolument by continuing their enquoy and therefore I am amazed. that the House. fhould upon this occafion be confidered in the light of a prefecutor. The Houle is now fitting in its judicial capacity; and if, as they proceed in that capacity, fresh evidence occurs, it is their duty to receive it. Mr. Horne, Sir, if really innocent, cannot be injured by the clofeft investigation. The more the truth is difcovered, the more bis character must be cleared in fuch a cafe; and if his friends do not really fufpect his innocence, they have no caufe to tremble for his fituation. Gentlemen bave been pleased to talk about the probability of fomebody's tampering with Mr. Woodfall's jour neymen; for my own part, I do not pretend to the spirit of prophecy, Mr. Speaker, nor do I know what fatif faction Mr. Woodfall's men may give us, though I fhall not be forry if it fhould be favourable to the person who has been just removed from your bar. But, Sir, if a charge of tampering could with propriety be infinuated at all, it should be against the profeffed champions for Mr. Horne. They take upon them, even at this moment, to predict what the evidence of the jour neymen printers will be; they tell you it will be lefs fatisfactory than Mr. Woodfall's. How do they know this? Upon what ground can they hazard their opinion? Have they already tam pered with the journeymen printers ? Away with the unmanly idea! The mind half acknowledges a turpitude in itself, which can lightly fufpect others of difingenuous arts, and I will. therefore believe that the gentlemen have spoken rather the language of their wishes, than the refult of their information. I am for getting as many lights as can be gotten upon the prefent occafon, and it is time enough to fit down, in total darkness, when there is not a ray to guide us any longer. Mr. D⋅nn-ng.] Mr. Speaker, I get up to oppose the prefent motion, Sir, upon two tolerable grounds, the grounds of common law and common fenfe. According to the first, as an Honourable member near me (alderman T-wnf-nd) has very properly. obferved, you cannot try any man a second time, for the fame offence; and, according to the latter, it would introduce numberless evils to exercise fuch a power, even if it could poffibly exist in a rational state of society. This Houle, I hope, Sir, in the prin ciples of fubftantial juftice, will never be inferior to the courts of Westmin➡ fters and though there may be a dif ference in the modes of their proceeding, ftill their determination fhould be fundamentally analagous. Give me leave, therefore, to fuppofe that you were Proceedings in Parliament, 1774. were prefiding in a common-law court of criminal jurifdiction, and that a prifoner was brought before you for a capital offence; fuppofe alfo, Sir, that the profecutor in fuch a cafe, failing in his proofs to convict, fhould beg for new time to look for fresh evidence, and tell you, that, if you allowed him a week or a fortnight longer, he would be able enough to bring fuch an army of evidences as would certainly convict the prifoner : Sir, you would fpurn the requeft with indignation, and commit the bratal profecutor for fo infamous an outrage upon the dignity, the juftice, of your court. Is not the prefent cafe exactly fimilar? Mr. Horné has been tried for his offence, the evidence against him is infufficient, and now the profecutor standing up, fays, Pray, my Lord, allow me a day or two to look for frefh evidence, and the prifoner fhail certainly be proved guilty in the courfe of the next week." If this doctrine is once established, there is an end of the fubjects fecurity; and if it is eftablished too by the very reprefentatives of the people, who mould protect them from oppreffion, the national difgrace will be equal to the national mifery, and we must fail equally the victims of fhame and defpotism. Mr.Att-rn y G-n-r-l.] Mr. Speaker, though I acknowledge that there is much ingenuity in the reafoning of my learned friend who fpoke last, I muft at the fame time fay that his argument is infinitely more fubtle than convincing.The principles of fubMantial justice, Sir, will, 1 fruft, be ever held as inviolably facred in this Houfe as in the courts of Weltminsterhall. We are not now differing about fubftantial juftice, but about the modes of adminiftering that juftice; and the learned gentleman has acknowledged, that different courts are regulated by different forms-We, Sir, are a court of enquiry, as well as a court of criminal jurifdiction; and if we faut our ears against information, we shall not be able to exercife the functions of our criminal jurifdiction with propriety. Here, Sir, a charge has been exhibited to us against Mr. Horne, in our capacity as a court of enquiry. In the difcuffion of this charge, it appears that fresh evidence may be had, to do what?-not to convict Mr. Horne not to fupport Mr. Woodfall-but to clear up the truth with presifion, and to enable us to do juf 343 tice. The Honourable gentleman fays, No, though you are fitting for the very purpose of difcovering the truth, you must choak up the channel of dif covery, and you must determine, in your character as a criminal juridiction, without receiving the neceffary information.-I grant, indeed, that if the three journeymen printers, who are now moved for to attend, were to be fought for at random, that if they had no relation to the present bufiaefs, and were to be maliciously hunted for in the streets, there would be some ground for complaint; but when they are the very people through whole hands the libel you have cenfured has paffed, when they rife actually out of their mafter's testimony, and have a tendeney to prove or difprove that very credibility which we are enquiring for in Mr. Woodfall's evidence, I think it highly injurious to juftice to oppofe their attendance, and wonder that gentlemen will not as readily fubfcribe to eftablished rules in parliament, as in the courts of Westminster-hall. With refpect to any cruel intention against Mr. Horne, I disclaim for one fo foul an idea. It is well knows, that, in my official character, I want no author. The printer of a libel is enough for me; and I ever think it injudicious even to look beyond the printer; officially, therefore, I am not Mr. Horne's profecutor. I have directed no profecution whatever against him; and perfonally, I am no more his enemy than any other member in the House. Farther than the cause of justice is concerned, his acquittal or conviction is to me a matter of utter indifference. If he is innocent, I should be very sorry he was not discharged; and if he is guilty, I fhould be very forry to fee a man efcape with impunity, who daringly libelled the British Commons legally af fembled in parliament. Mr. S l-ct-r-G-a-r-l.]. The Ho. member, Mr. Speaker, who spoke lalt but one [Mr. D.nn-ng], has dawn a very plaufible, though a very defective parallel between this House and the common courts of criminal jurifdic tion; inferring, because a jury in the latter, when charged with a prifoner, are obliged to pronounce upon his guilt or innocence before they are allowed to depart, that we are under the fame neceffity of deciding, without adjournment, whenever a prifoner is arraigned at our bar. Sir, I must affirm, with my learned friend who spoke 344 Solution of the Geometrical Question in the Magazine for May. Taft, that, though fubftantial justice is as much the object of purfuit in this Houfe as in other courts of criminal jurifdiction, we must be regulated by our own forms, and not by the forms of any different tribunal. Should the members of the long robe, adopting the idea to ferve a particular turn, contend in Westminsterhall, that the Judges fhould abolish their own forms which have existed fo many ages, and proceed intirely by the forms eftablished in this House, I am afraid that there would fpeedily be an end of all law, and an end, moreover, of what is still more important, of all fubftantial justice.-The Hon. gentleman has been pleafed to infinuate, that there are no inftances of adjourning the trials of offenders before this Houfe. By trial, he must neceffarily mean examination; for, in cafes where a contempt has been offered to our privileges, we have no other mode of trial. This being admitted, I must exprefs my furprize that he is not better acquainted with the courfe of parliamentary proceedings. Our Journals abound with precedents of remanding prifoners for further examinati n and even in the molt folumn of all trials, the trial of Peers for capital crimes, the inftances of adjournment are numberless.-The fact, with reSpect to adjournments, being thus afcertained, I must now examine the doctrine which the Hon. gentleman has laid down, to fhew what he thinks would be the confequence, if adjourn ments were allowed where a pritoner is put upon his defence before a jury. Should a malicious profecutor," fays he, fail in his first proofs ro convict, and fhould he be allowed time to find out farther evidence, the subject would never be fecure; irnocence would be the eternal victim of malignity; and our courts of law would only be fo many mockeries of justice.-As our courts of law, however, where a jury is charged with a prisoner, do not alJow the profecutor, if he fails in his firft proofs, the liberty to feek for fresh evidence, the Hon. gentleman's fears may be intirely eafy on this head : yet there are cafes where the common courts of criminal jurifdiction not only adjourn trials, though the priforer is brought before a jury, but where it would be highly injurious to the subjed not to grant fuch an adjournment.-Suppofe, Mr. Speaker, that a material witness to prove the innocence of a prifoner was by any accident in a diftant country, or beyond fea, or pre- SOLUTION to the Queftion in the IF the three fides of any triangle be In this question, where the triangle is a right-angled one, the bifecting line drawn from the right angle, being half the hypothenufe (Euclid, Book 3. Prop. 31.) the diftance of the point of interfection, or center of gravity, from the right angle, will be one third of the hypothenufe, or 32 chains; its diftances from the two other angles are 49,5 and 52,6 chains respectively. A. B. ERRATUM... Gent. Mag. for June, p. 257. in the demonftration, for angle read triangle. Remarks Remarks on the Act for preferving the Health of Prifoners. 345 Remarks on the bill, entitled, "An Ad for preferving the health of prifoners in gaol, and preventing the goal diflemper." Anno 1774. WHEN the defign of this bill is confidered, the humanity of thofe who firft fuggefted it cannot be too much commended: but perfection is not the offspring of a day; and ufeful as the bill may be found in many ref pects, it appears to me capable of fome improvement, which I fhall endeavour -briefly to point out. It wifely inculcates cleanliness: "the feveral Juftices of the Peace are authorifed and required, to order the walls and cielings of the feveral cells and wards, both of the debtors and felons, and alfo of any other rooms ufed by the prifoners, in their respective gaols and prifons, where felons are usually confined, to be fcraped and white. washed, once in the year at least; to be regularly washed and kept clean, and conftantly fupplied with fresh air, by means of hand ventilators, or otherwife; to order 2 rooms in each goal or prifon, one for the men, and the other for the women, to be fet apart for the fick prifoners, directing them to be removed into fuch rooms as foon as they fhall be feized with any diforder, and kept feparate from those who fhall be in health; to order a warm and cold bath, or commodious bathing-tubs, to be provided in each gaol or piton, and to direct the prifoners to be washed in foch warm or cold baths, or bathing-tubs, according to the condition in which they shall be at the time, before they are fuffered to go out of fuch gaols or prifons upon any occafion whatever." But with all thefe precautions, which are chiefly taken to prevent the pri foners from infecting the Judges on the bench, no provifion is made for the fafety of the people at large; and I fear not a fufficient one for the fecurity even of the Judges themselves, as not a single word is admitted into this bill, relative to the infected apparel of the prifoners.-Bathing the body will avail little while that body is still to be covered with garments as poisonous as the fhirt of Neffus, and peculiariy capable, not only of reaining, but alfo of communicating infection. This is confirmed by repeated experience in the cafe of the plague, the infection of which is conveyed from and region to another by the medium of cotton, woolen, and other porcus Lubstances. GENT. MAG. August, 1774. This preventive bill, indeed, authorifes Justices of the Peace, at their quarterly feffions, to order clothes to be provided for the prifoneis "when they fee occafion;" and that, furely, can be only when the danger is imminent, and ftares them in the face: for let us confider what good can be expected from fuch a difcretionary power, by reviewing the nature of this infection, whofe fatal effects are much better known than its gradual progrefs, Like the fmall pox, it may be received as well into the garments, as the fyftem of a prifoner, and lie inactive for a certain period; and while lateri bæret lethalis arundo, there may be little or no fufpicion of danger: in fach inftances, many of which have occurred to me, the Justice, however diftinguifhed for humanity and difcernment, is not likely to discover that occafion which the bill alludes to. If he should happen to entertain a flight fufpicion of danger, he could only have it removed or confirmed by the infpe&tion of fome skilful phyfician: but the bill has Atrangely interdicted the approach of a phyfician to any gaol or prifon, exprefsly directing, that all medical advice and affiftance thall be given, at a ftated falary, by a furgeon or an apothecary physicians, therefore, in a matter of the first importance to the health of the community, are, by an act of the legislature, excluded from interpofing their aid. I have been acacquainted with fome examples, where prisoners have received infection, without any evident fymptoms while they remaine in their wretched confine ment; but foon after they have been allowed to breath a vital atmosphere, the symptoms of a gaol fever have arisen, and they have become capable of diffufing the fame poison to all about them; and thus Juftices on the bench may fuffer, when no fufpicion of danger is entertained. Befides fome recent instances at the Old Bailey, and in the laft Lent circuit, the fatal transaction at Salt-hill is fufficient to prove the danger of referring the circumftance of new cloathing the prifoners to fuftices "as they fee occasion." It is likewife a fact of general notoriety, that a prifoner may, by habit, be exempted from taking a gaol fever, though expofed to the most virulent infection; but his clothes may be no Jef's loaded with this poifon ; and while he remains invulnerable in his own mephitic atmosphere, an healthy-per ton, |