your old figure, the transportation for clothing for 2,000,000 men is going to represent very much more than your new figure. Capt. DALY. I will have to get the details of that estimate. I am not familiar with how it was arrived at. For example, take clothing and equipage. It appears that the branch that handles that figured 141,145 tons total to be shipped of clothing and equipage. Mr. SHERLEY. Was that on your first estimate or your new estimate? Capt. DALY. On the first estimate. Mr. SHERLEY. What do they figure now? Capt. DALY. They have not changed it. Mr. SHERLEY. Then it is perfectly evident that the first time they figured, they figured too much for 1,000,000 men, if it is going to be enough now for 2,000,000 men. Capt. DALY. Yes; the total of their figures would indicate that only $51,684,000 is required for this whole number of 2,033,000 men. Mr. SHERLEY. Whereas when they were figuring for 1,000,000 men they figured $46,500,000. Capt. DALY. Yes; $46,424,000 was allotted for that purpose. Mr. SHERLEY. And these payments are on the same basis as the others the regular tariff for freight less the land-grant reduction? Capt. DALY. Yes; less the land-grant deduction or the equalization on the part of the railroads that are not land-grant roads. There is no special reduction for this freight at all. Mr. SHERLEY. You only get the special reduction of 5 per cent on passenger traffic? Capt. DALY. That is all. Mr. SHERLEY. What is the total quantity in weight that is figured to be moved for this $52,000,000? Capt. DALY. The total tonnage we estimated would be moved under this $51,684,000, consisting of clothing and equipment, subsistence stores, forage, motor vehicles, and other quartermaster supplies-and we mean by that such things as camp equipment, buckets, rakes, shovels, horseshoes, etc., medical stores, signal stores, and engineer stores is 7,296,055 tons. TRANSPORTATION OF HORSE EQUIPMENT, OF ORDNANCE AND ORDNANCE STORES. Mr. SHERLEY. Your next item is for the transportation of horse equipment, of ordnance and ordnance stores, and small arms from the foundries and armories and places of purchase to the arsenals, fortifications, military posts, and Army depots. How much of the previous appropriation was allotted for this purpose? Capt. DALY. $5,411,840. Mr. SHERLEY. You are now asking an additional amount of $1,082,370? Capt. DALY. Yes, sir. Mr. SHERLEY. This, again, is practically railroad freight transportation? Capt. DALY. Yes, sir. Mr. SHERLEY. And a little incidental water transportation inside the United States? 4400-17-29 Capt. DALY. Yes, sir. It is based on an estimate from the Ordnance Department. They estimated 649,421 tons. Mr. SHERLEY. What did they estimate in the first instance when you made your first estimate? Capt. DALY. I have not that figure here. They had a different estimate, as I remember it, and later they added to it. Mr. SHERLEY. There, again, for 1,000,000 men you were figuring five times as much originally as you are now figuring for the additional million men? Capt. DALY. They figured that. Of course, I do not know what they included in that. Mr. SHERLEY. In the estimate that was submitted before the Committee on Military Affairs for this item it was estimated that only $1,183,840 would be needed. Capt. DALY. That was a peace estimate. Mr. SHERLEY. No; that was the estimate that was made in connection with the $3,000,000,000 lump-sum appropriation which was asked for. Capt. DALY. Did the Quartermaster General testify to that? Mr. SHERLEY. Nobody testified to it, but there was submitted by Lieut. Col. Baker, of the Quartermaster Corps, a detailed statement, which Maj. Pierce, as I recall, presented to the Military Affairs Committee. Now, perhaps I have come to the real explanation of what has happened. Instead of these allotments you have made out of your previous appropriation of $236,000,000 or $237,000,000 being what was originally estimated, they were allotments made subsequently, with the knowledge that you were going to supply equipment for 2,000,000 instead of 1,000,000 men, and have now been revised and added to with the knowledge that has come to you subsequently? Capt. DALY. I am not so sure about that, Mr. Sherley. We will have to inquire into that, because I do not think when they made these allotments-I am not stating this as a fact-we knew of the 2,000,000 men. Mr. SHERLEY. For instance, I find in the item that we previously discussed, where you had an allotment made of $46,500,000, that the figures submitted by Col. Baker were $18,000,000. When were these present allotments made? Capt. DALY. I think they were made in June of this year. Mr. SHERLEY. Were they made at the same time that this new estimate was figured on? Capt. DALY. No; the new estimate was not figured on until July 8. Mr. SHERLEY. So you made the allotment of your available funds in June? Capt. DALY. After the appropriation in the urgent deficiency bill became effective. Mr. SHERLEY. And then in July you made your new estimate, having in mind those old allotments? Capt. DALY. Yes. These new allotments, when they were made by the Quartermaster General, to the branches or divisions of the office from the totals of the urgent deficiency appropriation plus the Army appropriation for 1918 were based on figures that were evidently submitted by the different branches. The branches gave an estimate of what they would require and the allotments were then made by the Quartermaster General. Now, what their requirements were based upon, Mr. Sherley, I am not able to state now. We can state that as soon as we find out at the office just what they based them on. Mr. SHERLEY. I thought you said that all of this estimate is now based on the contemplated cost of transportation of men and materials for an army of 2,033,000 men; is that true? Capt. DALY. Yes, sir; that is evidenced by the deductions we make here. We have only asked for the difference between the amount that was allotted and the total requirements for 2,033,000 men. Of course, I will say that it is evident that the allotment made covered more than 1,072,000 men. Mr. SHERLEY. It must have. Capt. DALY. And that is the reason I say that when the branches gave their estimates to the F. and A. division of our office of the amount of funds they would require under each of these items, they must have based it on a larger number of men than we estimated for. Now, to give them these amounts, other amounts probably will have to be reduced. I am only giving this now, as I assume it. I do not know that that is the fact. Mr. SHERLEY. I wish you would ascertain and supply with the table you are going to put in the allotment that has been made under funds now available from the regular bill and the deficiency bill, and wherever the allotment was made on a basis other than 1,000,000 men, by a footnote, indicate what the basis was. Appropriation for transportation of the Army and its supplies. For transportation of the Army Transportation of recruits and re- Transportation of horse equip ment, of ordnance and ordnance stores, and small arms. $1,985,420 $20,001, 115.00 $31,865, 475.50 $53, 852, 010.50 $31,865, 475.50 5,259, 890.00 17, 261,6 30,000.00 30,000.00 612.00 120,000.00 1,082, 370.00 3,091, 910.00 Army.. 375, 600 Transportation of funds. 4,235,040.00 Payment of wharfage tolls and 7,600 53,063.50 ferriages.. Drayage and cartage at depots and posts.. Packing and crating company property and baggage. Draft and pack animals, purchase of.. Appropriation for transportation of the Army and its supplies--Continued. For purchase and repair of harness and pack equipment.... Purchase of wagons and carts and drays.... $205,033 947, 261 2,455, 510 8,100,000.00 163,266,000.00 173, 821, 510.00 Purchase of motor trucks and Other employees.. 874,000 326,000 64,000,000.00 64,000,000.00 874,000.00 Total.... 16,000,000 221,963, 745. 42 450, 490, 305.00 688, 454, 050. 42 36, 922, 527.08 TRANSPORTATION OF ANIMALS FROM PLACE OF PURCHASE TO REMOUNT DEPOTS. Mr. SHERLEY. Your next item is for the transportation of animals for the Army from places of purchase to remount depots and from depots to the troops at military posts and stations in the field, etc. How much was allotted for that purpose? Capt. DALY. $5,494,220. Mr. SHERLEY. You are now asking for $1,022,530? Capt. DALY. Yes, sir. Mr. SHERLEY. Do you know on what basis the allotment of $5.494.000 was made? Capt. FAIR. In the transportation branch we based our allotments on approximately 500,000 men for the Regular Army, 500,000 men for the National Guard, and 500,000 men for the National Army. When we made up our estimates for animals and wagons in our branch, the last ones we made previous to this one were made on that basis, and there has been no change as to the basis of the estimate, as far as I can learn. Then we added for the transportation of animals the additional number of animals required for the 2,000,000 men. Mr. SHERLEY. You did not add a fixed ratio, evidently, because if it took $5,500,000 for 1,500,000 men, it would take something more than one million for the additional 500,000 men. Capt. FAIR. The situation had changed somewhat. For instance, they had authorized the construction of auxiliary depots for each. division, so that the animals could be bought as near as possible to the troops and led right out of the depot to the troops. Mr. SHERLEY. So that in point of fact by virtue of a new arrangement you figured that it was not going to cost you $5,500,000 for 1,500,000 men, and that therefore your total cost for 2,033,000 men would be approximately $6,500,000, instead of a greater sum, if your unit cost had remained the same? Capt. FAIR. Yes, sir. Mr. SHERLEY. Now, in arriving at this new estimate of $6,500,000 for 2,033,000 men and officers, on what basis did you work? How do you figure that cost? Capt. FAIR. This branch did not figure out the allowance. We simply stated the number of animals, and Capt. Daly's branch figured that out. Capt. DALY. This statement shows that they figured on a total of 434,450 animals to be moved at an average price of $15 per head. Mr. SHERLEY. That is their latest figure as to the number of animals necessary for the army of 2,033,000 men. Capt. FAIR. No, sir; that is the number that will have to be moved. There are already a lot of animals in the hands of the Regular Army and the National Guard that are not included. Mr. SHERLEY. But they will have to be moved. Capt. DALY. They are included in this first item. Mr.. SHERLEY. Then, to re-form my question, this constitutes an estimate of the number of new animals? Capt. FAIR. Yes, sir. Mr. SHERLEY. These animals are based on an estimate having in mind the determination of the department to eliminate the number of Cavalry divisions that they originally figured on? Capt. FAIR. Yes, sir. Mr. SHERLEY. And that $15 a head is based on your previous experience as to the cost of movement of them? Capt. FAIR. It is the average cost from the place of purchase to the place of delivery. Mr. SHERLEY. Based on your previous experience? Capt. FAIR. Yes, sir. TRANSPORTATION OF FUNDS FOR THE ARMY. Mr. SHERLEY. The next item is, for the transportation of funds. for the Army. How much was allotted previously for this purpose? Capt. DALY. $120,400. Mr. SHERLEY. You are now asking for $25,787.09 ? Capt. DALY. Yes, sir. Mr. SHERLEY. What is that for-express? Capt. DALY. Yes, sir. Mr. SHERLEY. And insurance or do you insure? Capt. DALY. No, sir; no insurance. PAYMENT OF WHARFAGES, TOLLS, AND FERRIAGES. Mr. SHERLEY. The next item is, for the payment of wharfage, tolls, and ferriages, including the purchase of street car tickets, commutation railroad tickets for transportation of recruits, and recruiting parties, etc. How much was allotted for that purpose? |
